Quote:
Originally Posted by Jack_
But I don't vote for him? I don't live in Islington North, so I vote for my local Labour candidate in the (very, very long) hope that they are elected to parliament, as an extra number in a larger Labour government. Despite however much the Tories tried to make this election campaign a presidential one, we still do not elect a Prime Minister directly. Like I said, I'm interested in policies - and I want the Labour programme enacted, a biffa bin could be the PM for all I care.
I don't agree with policies having to strictly align with the values of the leader in all honesty. Certainly the general ideology and direction of travel will in part be steered by the leader of a party, but the argument against this can be seen in two examples. Firstly, Corbyn's views on trident are well known - but the large majority of the PLP are in favour of its renewal, so that commitment was in the manifesto. As he said in his interview with Jeremy Paxman, he is a leader not a dictator - and that's exactly how manifestos and policy platforms should be put together, with contributions and consensus across the party (contrast this with the Tories' manifesto that post-election almost the entire party have criticised). Secondly, I drew attention earlier to Theresa May's inaugural speech last July where she was trying to position herself as a moderate, centrist Conservative looking to help the 'just about managing' - and yet the manifesto she campaigned on couldn't have been further from this, even attacking their core base of voters. One has to wonder what her personal values actually are, or whether she just chops and changes depending on which way the wind is sailing or how far right she thinks she can get away with being elected on.
Of course they would, I don't deny that at all - but is that such a bad thing? I'm not going to get into a debate about the specifics of that policy because it's been done ad nauseum during the campaign, but what I will say is that not every country in the world charges tuition fees so it clearly can work. Isn't it a good thing to have a bit of hope anyway? Instead of the bitter continual misery the Tories were promising? Why on earth would many young people - who have been ignored for years by political parties and yet criticised for not voting - vote for that? If he ever became PM and didn't do what he said he would, I'm sure he'd face the same fate as Nick Clegg, but until then what's wrong with giving it a shot? You never know until you try, and many people (students or otherwise) are quite clearly fed up with austerity. What I will point out however is that from my perspective a lot more young people are politically engaged than you might realise, certainly moreso than your average member of the electorate. Until the Tories actually start offering something to young people instead of attacking and ignoring them, they will continue to be seen for the Nasty Party that they are.
Finally, you say that you like neither Labour nor the Tories which is fine but it seems to me like you direct all your criticism at Corbyn and none at Theresa May. Her record in the Home Office is a disgrace (particularly on abuse in detention centres, and her reckless cuts to the police), as it is on LGBT rights (idc if she voted for equal marriage quite frankly), she indirectly funds terrorism by selling arms to the Saudis, and wants the poor and the disabled to pay for an international crisis they didn't cause. I find that just as horrible, disgusting and dangerous to be honest.
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Thanks for replying - I'm an avid reader who likes the longer, well thought out post, and you make your personal position very clear. I always squirm when someone has taken the trouble to post a thoughtful and interesting response like yours and all they get in return is a sarcastic one liner.
I take all your opinions on board as very valid for you, and I respect your ideals, but personally I don't agree with voting to get a party into power whose current leader's very dubious morals and association with terrorists cause me to feel sick to my stomach.
He is untested, too. He can't deliver all the promises he has made willy - nilly to all and sundry, and surely we are not that daft to think his policies are going to make a fantastic difference, that this time it's all going to be all right.
If he was a strong, moral figure, with no awful past history, whose own party members exuded sincere trust in, then I would feel hope, because it doesn't matter to me whether we have a gov. of Cons or Labour, I'm in the middle. But we've been down the road of disappointment too many times for me to think that THIS man in particular is going to deliver.
How could I when I personally loathe him and what he has stood for? Yes, apart from all the above, he is the man who supported the IRA terrorists in my home N.Ireland who murdered and maimed my beloved friends, who sympathised with the terrorists who indiscriminately murdered innocent woman and children out shopping or attending a fun run event. He spoke at IRA rallies, he attended commemorations for their dead, he was an integral part of a terrorist publication which promoted violence. He was doing all this in the 70's (as well as later)
before he even became an MP. We in N.Ireland know of him of old, probably when many of you were just kids or not even born.
He lies and tries to talk his way out of it by saying he was trying to promote peace, when he actually opposed the peace agreement and he NEVER, at any time, took part in anything to do with the Good Friday Agreement. He places McDonnell, another despicable IRA apologist at the same time, in a prominent position in Gov.
That is why May is not on my radar in the same way. But apart from my personal feelings, she is nowhere in Corbyns league when it comes to actively supporting and being an apologist for murderers.
HE supported those who destroyed the lives of so many families in my community.
I tried to think - maybe he's changed and regrets his past activities. He seems mellower. But even now he baulks at condemning the IRA outright and their reign of terror instead of them fighting their battle democratically. He has other dubious links too which cannot be just brushed under the carpet.
But I understand that you don't have those personal prejudices and experiences so therefore can't feel the same passions as I do.
But I could never, ever, consider such a man as the Prime Minister of my country, however attractive his policies and promises appear. I fear him. Not for his strength, but for his weakness and fascination for those that yield power through terror.
Have I missed something,
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